by | Jul 11, 2023 | Magnetic Pod

JULY 12, 2023


E21 S3 Be Bold, Be Rebellious: Swapna Thomas’s Brave Marketing Insights

Be Bold, Be Rebellious Swapna Thomas's Brave Marketing Insights

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Welcome to another episode of the podcast! In this episode, I had the pleasure of interviewing Swapna Thomas, a marketing coach who helps coaches fall in love with marketing. We discussed her journey from being a stay-at-home mum and blogger to becoming a content strategist and coach.

Swapna shared how she stumbled upon the importance of positioning herself to attract high-end clients, and how she naturally started using storytelling in her content to create an emotionally connected audience. She also gave some great tips on using client sessions to create content that resonates with your audience.

We also talked about her Brave Framework, which teaches female entrepreneurs to be bold, rebellious, authentic, value-driven, and empowered in their marketing. And she even created a free workbook called the Soul Led Sales, which features 11 journal prompts that have helped her and clients sell out launches with ease.

If you’re looking for some great insights on marketing and content creation, be sure to check out Swapna’s Brave Marketing podcast!

Connect with Swapna: 

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Podcast produced by Livvi Music Media


Note: this transcript was generated automatically. Its accuracy may vary.

[00:00:00] That is what? Positioning means is that you’re speaking to the audience that can actually buy the offers that you are putting out there, and not just can buy, but is actively looking to buy those things, right? They, you don’t have to convince them to see the value of your offer. You don’t have to tell them five reasons you need to invest in this.

They are already looking for something like that and you’re just share sharing why this is exactly what you have been looking

for. Hey, my name is Olivia Deza. I’m dedicated to helping multi-passionate entrepreneurs turn their dreams into reality by building a career and a life they love. And making a positive impact in the world.

I’m a podcast and social media manager, a singer songwriter, a kids’ music creator, a, a wife and a mum. I’m the secret weapon behind many six and seven figure entrepreneurs helping them shine, line and [00:01:00] call in the people they are here to serve. And now I’m here to help you. This podcast is here to help you learn and be inspired.

You’ll learn about podcasting, lead generation, business, and all about the real life stories of people behind the businesses. Just like you think of it as a place to hang out with your like-minded business bestie who gets what it’s like. So grab a cup and hit subscribe so we can hang out. Again, this is Magnetic Pod, the podcast.



Thomas, is someone who I have. Followed and admired for many years. We shared many mutual friends on Facebook and ended up getting to know each other online, and I’ve always really admired you as an exceptional content creator. Her posts resonate with me and evoke emotions and inspire me to pause and reflect.

She [00:02:00] is a marketing coach on a mission to help. Coaches fall in love with marketing. She hosts the Brave Marketing Podcast, so go check that out, which features weekly episodes on soul and strategy of marketing, mindset, money, and everything related to online business. For the past three years, Swapna has been working with mission driven life coaches to help them use marketing for good and make a lot of money while doing it.

She believes that good people making money only leads to more good because they go back and spend it. Uh, And help other women in business and help their family and future generations. So Wapner’s Brave Framework teaches female entrepreneurs to be bold, rebellious, authentic, value driven, and empowered in their marketing.

She has even created a free workbook called The Soul led Sales, which. Features 11 journal prompts that have helped her and clients sell out launches with absolute ease. And I know I did get one of your workbooks [00:03:00] once that I really, really loved and found that it was packed full of value and lots of great ideas.

So welcome. So good to have

you. Thank you for that. Wonderful. In introduction. I think it’s always surreal to hear someone else introduce you and you know, just to have that third party perspective on your work and your journey. But I. I’m so excited that we are finally getting down to having this conversation about marketing online business and all amazing things, and I, I also of course, have loved you and admired you for a very long time.

Ever since we have been in the same circles, and I think both of us have had. A lot of evolution in our, uh, online journey throughout this time. Absolutely. So I’m sure we have so much to share and just because this industry is so dynamic and I, you know, I sometimes laugh when I see people saying, this is the new thing, and I’m like, oh no, this has been [00:04:00] done.

So can you tell me a bit about your journey from, you started as a mom, mom blogger, is that right? And then became a content strategist. So tell me what led you to where you are now.

So I think it was all just, I was just reacting to what life was at that point of time. So I had a corporate career and then I had my daughter.

So I was very clear, like this corporate career, I, I was an unemployable person, you know, like I was not, not the best employee ever, but I was really good at, and then now in retrospect, what do

you say that. Sorry. Why do you say you were

unemployable? Because I would find like daily routines very tedious and boring, which is, you know exactly what happens in a job.

And I now [00:05:00] also see, now that I have, uh, more information about d, adhd, I feel like. Of course, you know, I found it horrible and tedious and mind numbing because I was not made for that. So when my daughter was born, you know, I, I almost took it out as an out from my job. Nobody was like, everyone was ready to support me if I wanted to work, but I was like, Nope.

I wanna be a stay at home mom and just like be there for my daughter, which was also the truth. Like I really wanted to be there because I was a LA lock and key child in the seventies, eighties, or rather, like I, I don’t wanna age myself even more, but eighties. So I really wanted to just like have that experience of being there for my daughter.

She grew up and that’s, You know why I became a stay at home mom. But then very quickly I realized that it’s quite boring to,

and also my [00:06:00] daughter ended up being very independent, as independent as a daughter can be. But she didn’t really need me all the time. Right? So then I found myself like with these hours that I had nothing to do with, and at that time I was reading a lot of mom blogs. So it just felt natural to just, you know, be curious about what would.

It feel like to start one. And I live in India for those who don’t know. So there were not many mom blogs in India at that time, and especially any mom blogs that were doing any kind of monetization, that was not at all happening. So I just felt like I was being pulled to just see and try and be curious about what would happen.

And I think I’ve always been that person who is absolutely. Okay with taking risks, like I don’t think too much about it. I don’t worry too much about it, so I just started it and very quickly it grew and even though I had a very niche audience and I had a small audience, I started getting really, really creative brand [00:07:00] deals.

And I think that’s where I first. Really started understanding about positioning and how your positioning can really set you apart and attract high-end clients even if you have a small audience. So people who had bigger audiences were not attracting the kind of brand needs that I was because I had positioned myself really well.

So, As that grew and as the blocking culture grew in my country, I started feeling this pressure from brands to include my daughter more and more in my content. And that was something I was not comfortable with. Like I didn’t want her to her to become the product and to, you know, for her life to be told through my content, which we see so much now, right?

Like on Instagram. Yeah. As the kids growing up, Maui here. Yeah, and I was absolutely uncomfortable about it. Like I wanted her life to be her experience and not seen through my lens all the time, right? Mm-hmm. So that’s why I decided, [00:08:00] like it just started feeling completely unaligned. And I, and I’m also the kind of person who cannot just do something for the money, like just because the money is good.

I. I’m not gonna do it. So I felt like naturally at that time, a lot of bloggers were asking me how are, how I was growing my blog? How was I getting these brand deals? How was I building a email marketing list? So I started feeling another. You know, t of, okay, let me see. Where does this go? Can I start talking about this?

So me and one of my blogger friends, we start, we created our first online course and we sold it out and, you know, within the blogging circles. And I was like, yeah, this is something I can actually do. And that is how I started looking. Into content strategy because that, that’s what I felt like I was doing at the time was content strategy, right?

Knowing what kind of headlines to use, what kind of topics to use. And it all just happened naturally. It wasn’t [00:09:00] like, oh, I, this is the next big thing, so let me jump into that. It just felt like this is what I have been doing. People are asking me about it more and more, so let me do this now. And it’s the same with coaching, like when I was doing quantum strategy, I realized that most of the time I was coaching people, you know, yeah, you can give people strategy, but if they have a lot of blocks around showing up visibility and just being themselves online, that strategy is not gonna work.

So I ended up coaching them around those things, and I felt like that was the next thing, just again, naturally it happened. So that’s my journey and, uh, Yeah. I feel like serendipity is one word for it. Like it just kept happening. The next thing and the next thing.

Uh, there’s so many interesting threads there.

You position it positioned yourself. How did you position [00:10:00] yourself?

Mm. Yeah, so I, you know, I, I do have an MBA as the background, just letting you know, and I think naturally I knew that you don’t want to go for quantity, you wanna go for quality, right? And I, mm-hmm. My, the way I wrote and the audience that I was speaking to, I knew that it was more educated.

Women who were either in corporate or who had quit corporate to raise their kids and had a certain kind of parenting philosophy when it came to their kids. So the more I started talking about that, like this is what we say in marketing. If you’re speaking to everyone, you’re speaking to, no one. Yes. But the more I started to speaking to a specific mother, because that mother was me.

So I was just speaking to other mothers who were like me. Right. Mm-hmm. The more I started growing into that niche and that niche was automatically, or I would say rather, luckily for me, it was the higher educated women who had more purchasing [00:11:00] power. Right. And brands were interested in those women.

Mm-hmm. Because they had the higher purchasing power, and also they had the decision making, uh, capacity. So they were the, they could make decisions in their household because they were financially independent or had their own money or whatever. So, That is what? Positioning means is that you’re speaking to the audience that can actually buy the offers that you are putting out there, and not just can buy, but is actively looking to buy those things, right?

They, you don’t have to convince them to see the value of your offer. You don’t have to tell them five reasons you need to invest in this. They are already looking for something like that and you’re just sh sharing why this is exactly what you have been looking for. So I think that is the positioning. I almost stumbled upon it, but in respective, I was able to sort of like distance myself and see, oh, so that’s what [00:12:00] I was doing unknowingly, but it really worked out for me.

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense, obviously, because if brands are looking for a particular, we want this kind of demographic, and you’ve pretty much honed them in front, right in front of, right in front of you as your audience, then of course that was valuable. Uh, at that point, was that, was that your intention at that?

Were you just sharing stories? What were you writing about at that stage? Do you remember?

Yeah, it was just stories like what was happening, but again, like I, I’ve always been the person who has guarded my private life. Quite privately. So my idea was not to lay my life bare online, like that was never my intention, and I’ve always been that person who feels like my husband has his own story.

If he ever wants to tell it, he has a right to tell it. And my daughter has her own story and she will tell it the way she wants to tell it. Right. So my focus was not on [00:13:00] really getting into the story so much, but it was more about. What was I feeling? What was I learning from this? What was I taking away from this?

So I was of course telling stories, but the stories were. Maybe like 5% of it, but the rest was about what was I making of the story? What was I taking away from the story? And that’s where people connected with me more, right? Mm-hmm. I think that’s also another audience differentiation, like, There is an audience for that salacious, knowing the tea kind of an audience, like people just get invested in other people’s lives so much.

They just, they just wanna know every little bit of detail from your life. But I was not curating that kind of an audience I was. I was mindful that I wanted an audience that was not there to just know about what am I eating, what am I doing? And you know, what did I say to my husband today? But more about like, what’s my thought process?

How do I look at parenting? How do [00:14:00] I see, you know, I had this post about mom bullying. Like how other moms unknowingly, unknowingly end up bullying other moms, especially new moms. Mm-hmm. Um, and that was such a po It had the most traffic on my website at that time. I remember like literally thousands of people were reading Wow.

My post every day. And so many women were in the comments and I had not even gone into like what exactly had happened with me. Like I just touched upon it a little bit, but they just were so. They just felt heard and seen by my emotions about the whole experience rather than the story so much I. What I felt about it and how it made me feel diminished, or it made me feel like I was not good enough.

That is what they connected on more. And even now, you know, when I’m asked, uh, teaching my clients to tell stories in their content, this is because a lot of people have. Preservations about telling their [00:15:00] stories. They don’t know exactly how much to share, right? So I tell them this, like even if you include one line of your story in your post, that’s enough for people to create an emotional connection.

You don’t have to put everything out there, you don’t have to like hang all of your dirty LA laundry for the world to see. But even if you just give them like one bit. They will really get what they need from that. So that’s how I was doing it. And it really connect, created a very connected audience, like emotionally connected audience.

And it’s something I just naturally do even now. So I think some of it is definitely natural. I was not doing any of it, like, you know, sitting and thinking, oh, so I’m gonna use storytelling as look, but that’s who I’m, and that just felt very natural to me.

Yes, I was listening to your most recent podcast, uh, which was a great one, and you had, I think, 10 different ways to create content and I loved all of them.

So yes, everybody go check that out. [00:16:00] So maybe you could share some of those. One of them I thought was interesting was, well, they were all interesting, but the one about having a, using your client sessions. Mm-hmm. You wanna talk.

Your clients are the best market research you can ever have. I have the conversations that you’re having with them and the questions that they’re asking, the, the confusion that they’re facing right now, it’s exactly what your other potential clients are going through as well, and I think a lot of people gatekeep that.

Those conversations that they’re having with their clients because they feel like if I’m gonna give everything away that I’m doing on my sessions, then why would people buy? But I feel like that’s exactly why they would buy. When you don’t get, keep those conversations, when you talk about how, you know, The, the conversation that your potential clients are having in their head is something that you are having [00:17:00] with your clients in real time.

So it just makes them feel, again, like it’s all about being, feeling seen and heard and accepted for the key in their head, for the confusion in, in their head for being, you know, made to feel not so isolated because most of us are. Having the same questions, having the same doubts, you know, being very self-critical of ourselves.

But we feel like we are the only ones with these thoughts. We are the only ones with these questions. No one is dumb enough to ask this. No one is that scattered or that lost in their business, and it’s, when I put those conversations out, they feel seen and they feel like. Oh, so this is normal. Like, you know, I can, I can have these thoughts and I can have these questions.

So that is why I feel like it should be something you should do. Of course, you should always be mindful of your client’s privacy. I would never give out, you know, any details about my clients. I would never go specific into any, [00:18:00] anything that would, uh, be an identifiable. Thing about my client completely protecting their anonymity.

Also, I wouldn’t share something that is like my client was feeling. So, you know, she was completely shattered and she was going through this huge emotional of he will like, I wouldn’t talk about my client like that because I always want them to feel empowered and to also have a safe space to have those conversations if my clients come in.

The into the space feeling, oh, is she going to use this as fodder for her content? I don’t think they’ll be able to feel that safe sharing things with me. Right. So it has, it’s a very nuanced thing. I feel, how to use your client conversations in content, but mostly I would say keep it to the things that you feel are not your client specific.

Like it’s not. Your one client going through that one thing in that one moment, but things that you feel like, yeah, I know like many people [00:19:00] are, feel feeling the same thing, or I have felt the same thing. I’ve been there and I’ve felt that. So I would take those things and put that into my content, but keep the, you know, more.

Personal things and more things that they’re feeling in the moment. I know that’s not who my client is, but she might be feeling like that in the moment. I wouldn’t use that in my content. So I always keep, give myself five to 10 minutes after a session, which I think is any ways a good practice to just integrate the space that you have held for your clients and to just process your own emotions and.

Just to write down two or three things that you felt like the big takeaways for your client from the session. Sometimes I learn so much from my own client sessions that I write tho those things down as well because I feel we are, this might sound a bit woo-hoo, but I don’t think it is. We are all connected with each other on a, you know, on a cellular level.

So when my client is going through [00:20:00] something, however, you know, Chaotic it might be, I know that, you know, at some level I’m going through the same thing. It might not be the same magnitude as my, what my client is going through, or it might not be exactly what they’re going through, but at some level there is something for me to learn from that and from for me to change in my own life and my business.

Right. So I always take that time to also see where am I doing this in my own life or in my business? Mm-hmm. Am I not showing up as powerfully as I can or am I, you know, not saying the things I really wanna be saying in my content? Am I holding back? So I take that five to 10 minutes to just. Do this sort of almost like a debriefing of myself, um, which I feel also helps me close the session and then energetically clear that space for the next client or for just like the li you know, my life.

So that’s, that’s something I really [00:21:00] enjoy doing and I feel like when my clients start doing it, they also see the difference in how the important becomes so much more specific, but also it becomes really easy.

I love that it’s, uh, it, it’s kind of a way to, to be present in a way instead of rushing from one thing into the next, and it’s a moment to stop and actually notice what’s just happened and, yeah, not, not lose all the, the value of.

Of that shared time with your clients, and that’s absolutely, that’s beautiful. And also, I guess it’s a parallel with what you were saying with your blogs that you started with, whether it’s, you are talking about your own stories or whether it’s drawing ideas from your clients’ sessions. It comes back to empathy in, in a way, isn’t it?

Because you, it creates content that people can recognize themselves in From your own stories. Yeah. Or from from your clients. Yeah.

So did you wanna share any other ideas about [00:22:00] where you find find content?

Oh, how long do you have?

Maybe not all 10 from that episode.

I mean, uh, if you’ll like, I feel like content is everywhere. Like how could it be run outta content? Okay.

I’ll, I’ll give you one. The i, one that I thought was particularly interesting is where you talk about areas that aren’t your niche or aren’t related to your business.

For example, yeah, say your, your cat, or. Or wherever else.

Oh, so many ways. Like, uh, my cat is an endless source of entertainment and content. Uh, I literally remember, like I was, you know, talking to one of my clients about the level of perseverance my cat has to. Hunt pigeons. He’s always, you know, he thinks that he’s capable of hunting them and he can hunt them.

Ever been a hunting cat, whatever, even lived outside the home. But he just, you know, sticks and [00:23:00] stays there for hours waiting for the pigeons to come. And I pretty much think like if a pigeon actually came that he, he would. Be confused with what to do with it. But yeah, so things like that. But also I love watching interviews, you know, with artists, with actors or anyone who’s in the field of creativity, singers, musicians, or all of those people, because I do feel like of our.

Businesses like art, you know? Mm-hmm. You have to be creative. You have to immerse yourself in your craft to be good at it, and the same ups and le uh, downs that especially actors go through, like they don’t know where their next paycheck is coming from. They don’t know if there’s this next launch or their next movie is going to work or not.

Mm-hmm. Right, and they have the same insecurities about themselves. Am I not good enough? Am I, you know, do people still wanna work with me? And you know, no, people are tired of me. Nobody wants to look at [00:24:00] my stuff anymore. It’s the same emotional rollercoaster that we go through. So I learn a lot about.

From those, from those interviews, like even yesterday I was watching this round table that Variety hosts on their YouTube channel with actors from drama, and there was Jennifer Coolidge on it, which was absolutely a delight. And they were all talking about their insecurities and. We, we look at these glamorous stars and we feel like, oh, they’ve got it all together.

Then they, they just know how to do it. But when you listen to those interviews, you see the process behind it, the the self-talk that they have to have with themselves, even when they have one Oscars or Emmys or whatever, right. They still have to. Have that talk with themselves and tell themselves that I am good enough, I can actually do this role.

No, I’m not a fraud. You know, I’m not, I’m not, uh, deceiving all of these people into believing that I have actual talent. I, I do have talent [00:25:00] and that is fascinating to me. Like, because we see these people living these glamorous lives, collecting all of these awards and actually being really good at their craft, but we never.

Think about the emotional and the mental. Sort of, you know, uh, process behind it. And again, for me, it makes me feel seen and accepted and heard. And I always get so many ideas about how to show up in your content, how to deal with that fraud syndrome that most of us have, and how to uplevel into the next identity that you wanna create.

So it’s an endless. Goldmine of content. Like literally for anyone who’s struggling with content, I would literally ask you to go and listen to your favorite actors YouTube interviews. Some actors are not great interviewees, but there are some who are really fascinating and you just love, love listening to their take on life and their [00:26:00] craft and everything in between.

And it can be. An amazing source of content for yourself if you let yourself think about it that way.

Yes. If I, if you think about it from that, that lens, I have found that I sometimes think no matter what path we take in life, uh, so that also in close to wave topical area, you might be looking at you, the lessons end up being much.

The same. Yeah. Yeah. Like for, for me, I learned a lot from learning to sing and it’s all about getting out of your own way and not self sabotaging and not wondering, can I hit that note or can’t I, or, or whatever. And, and then, and the lessons of whether it’s that or whether it’s becoming an actor or musician or whether it’s, uh, whether it’s a sport or whether it’s having a business, we, yeah, it’s, it’s a big mind game and we all go


The conversations that you are having with yourself and how are you changing that conversation and how are you rewiring [00:27:00] that conversation? Because if you’re on that autopilot mode and you’re just, you know, going with what your brain is telling you, and our brain is such a beautiful liar, it tells us all the wrong things around ourselves all the time, and with good intentions, obviously to just, it wants to keep you safe and you know, in your known zone of comfort so that you don’t take any big risk and end up.

Killing yourself according to the primal brain, which always thinks that we are in a, a death, life or death situation. Right? But we have to be able to challenge those lies and to be able to actually see the truth and the conversations that we are having with our, our soul and our spirit and our higher self becomes so much more important.


I ask you about the ADHD that I see? I just discovered. I just recognized it in myself, shall I say, uh, last year and now I look everywhere. All my, all my friends, all [00:28:00] my entrepreneur friends are all having the same conversations. And so you recently mentioned it and. So how long has that been a thing in your life that you’ve been aware of?

And it makes so much sense with what you said earlier in your career and everything, and your tendencies and risk taking and all of that.

Yeah. So I have to give a disclaimer here. I’ve not been officially diagnosed, so Please, okay. Everything I say with the grain of salt, like, you know, this is not my, I do, I’m not giving any kind of medical advisor, but everything that I have, and I, my husband is a, he is a doctor, so we have had those conversations and he does.

You know, concur with me, but at the same time, I do not want to go down the medication route. Mm-hmm. So I’m not, actually, I’ve decided not to get tested because the, the reason I would get tested is if I wanted to take medication for it. Right? Yes. But I’m not feeling that calling right now. So, For me, it was just, it just made sense of so many things that I [00:29:00] never, you know, really thought about.

And honestly, and also because A D H D is such a spectrum, right? Like how I feel about how my A D H D shows up might not be how your A D H D shows up. Um, and there are certain similarities, of course, like at the base level it’s all connected, but some things are very, very specific. To maybe me and some things might be very, very specific to you, but what I have realized is that it just gave me permission to be mini even more.

I always felt like I have been myself, but it just gave me another layer of permission to accept myself, especially when. Things like walking into walls, being uncoordinated while cooking, like, you know, things that, like simple things like stirring a meal, which felt like I, I felt like I don’t know how to do this.

You know, we do it so beautifully and like, almost like magic, and it was always a challenge for [00:30:00] me. Like, I felt like I was uncoordinated with certain things, you know? And it felt like, what’s wrong with you? You are an educated, highly educated woman who works and you know, why can’t you do these simple things?

And then I realized like, oh, There are some fundamental differences in the way I am built and how I look at space and I ha how I interact with space. So all of those things started making sense and again, like I, I read about it, but I’ve also consciously not led myself in the rabbit hole of those things.

But that’s a personal choice honestly, because I, I’ve never wanted to let that become my identity. If that makes sense. I have d h, adhd. I am not d h adhd. Yes.

You know, I, I, yeah, because I agree. I understand that too, because I do tend to be talking about it, and I don’t mean to necessarily make it that I am d h D because part of me feels the same.[00:31:00]

As you and I did go down the, the route of getting a diagnosis and I hoped that, uh, medication would be, because I hear it can be life-changing for people. Yeah. And I had, it couldn’t really tell, but in the, if it was doing anything, so I’m not on a medication, but at the end of the day, I use it as a language to describe almost like a personality or tendency or, uh, so I do, I don’t love the name, don’t love.

Claiming I’ve got something where it says deficit and disorder in it. I don’t love that. Yeah. Uh, but I do equate it, and this is a bit like using life as content, and I’ve been say, uh, talking about this a little bit, I, I’ve been looking at the dog we have and going. Would you look at a working dog who needs a lot of space?

Who needs to run around, who’s looking everywhere all the time? Who’s a risk taker? Who needs to go hunt dogs and put it in a small apartment and expect it to be [00:32:00] compliant and obedient? And would you say that that’s a disordered, deficient dog, or would you say, oh, I understand why he’s not coping very well because.

This is the way he’s built and this is the way he’s, and that’s a superpower in certain contexts. Yeah. And a deficit if you put him in a small apartment and expect him to, it’s a bit like the old, was it a Einstein quote? If you expect to fish took

laboratory. Yeah.

Tree. Then he is gonna spend his life thinking he’s dumb.

So I use it as a language, as a way to, to sort of describe. The risk taking. The risk taking behaviors, the multi-passionate people, the, yes, you might lose your own iPhone a few times, but it’s all part of the same package and certain things are. Uh, you know, strengths in one context and annoying in another context.

Yeah. Yeah. I, I do also understand not wanting

to, yeah. And I, I think also because I am inching towards [00:33:00] perimenopause right now, so I feel like there’s a whole another layer that comes with that. Right. Uh, so I feel. Just taking things one thing at a time, not going into any kind of rabbits hole and letting anything define me, because again, I feel when I read experiences of women having perimenopause, not everyone has the same symptoms.

Not everyone feels, um, like the next woman, right? So I feel like. We should, for me personally, I feel like I just wanna know a little bit about it, enough for me to make sense of it and then live my own experience and work with that. Right. But I also understand the need to. No, and to really, you know, see how that can change your life.

And I, I feel like everyone has their own journey when it comes to stuff like this. So I feel you are doing the best thing for yourself, and I’m excited to see like what more you learn about yourself.[00:34:00]

All right. So, uh, would you, like, we have been talking a little while, so we need to, Wrap up shortly, but before we do, did you wanna share anything? Like what, what programs, what you’re running at the

moment? Yeah, so I am currently, I’m. Enrolling only for two containers, or, I don’t like the word containers so much, but programs, honestly, one is my high level, one-on-one and the other is an upcoming mastermind, which is not yet open.

But you will see me soon start to starting to talk about it. But honestly, I know people say that one-on-one work is not scalable and you know, it’s not. How you can build a big business, but I just love one-on-one work so much. It’s, it’s, it just gives me life. I love working one-on-one with people because I feel really get to, um, see a person, you know, really help them understand themselves.

Like people, people come for me for messaging and [00:35:00] content and strategy, but at the end, what happens always is that, They walk away knowing more about themselves. They walk away knowing, uh, you know how their brain is. Processing certain things that happened a while ago or, uh, how they have made sense of what their childhood was and how it is affecting them right now.

So we go into so much of depth in one-on-one, which is, I feel like you can, you know, people can say all sorts of things, but you can do that in a group setting. It’s just not possible. You can say that it’s intimate and it’s, you know, I’m curating and I’m making it really. Uh, in depth. It’s, it’s not possible.

Like the one-on-one is a sacred experience and someone who has experienced it can, you know, uh, tell you that how it feels, but also it depends on how someone is holding one, uh, the one-on-one space, and how much do [00:36:00] are they present for their clients, and how much do they create that safety for them to really be who they are in that program.


true. Like, I mean, I mean groups can be wonderful, but there are is a certain thing if you’re feeling very, any shame or embarrassment about certain areas, you may not wanna share it. So, yeah, I think that’s beautiful. Alright, so how can people re find you?

My website is the best place you can visit my website, swap north

Also reach out to me on Instagram or Facebook on my personal profile. I’m sure Olivia will put all the links in the description, but yeah, just DM me. I love connecting with people so you don’t have to be very formal with me. Just tell me that you listened to our episode and if you wanted to ask me any questions, I would be happy to answer those as well.


Thank you so much.

Thank you.[00:37:00]